tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post7547206506521986873..comments2024-03-29T17:12:19.648+13:00Comments on Bowalley Road: Endgame: Will Winston Peters Blow Up The Coalition Over Ihumatao?Chris Trotterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09081613281183460899noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-54691252646803239992019-08-12T17:48:24.475+12:002019-08-12T17:48:24.475+12:00"We keep pretending that the political spectr..."We keep pretending that the political spectrum runs from right to left. It doesn't. It runs from top to bottom" Mollie IvinsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-26562600291821399772019-08-12T16:05:26.754+12:002019-08-12T16:05:26.754+12:00Jesus. I thought Bassett must be dead by now. Last...Jesus. I thought Bassett must be dead by now. Last time I saw him, which must be at least 10 years ago he did not look good. Still a spiteful wee bastard I see.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-58640948086918212772019-08-11T11:48:06.546+12:002019-08-11T11:48:06.546+12:00Listening to media gatekeeper Kim Hill yesterday. ...Listening to media gatekeeper Kim Hill yesterday. She had a professor on who attributes the rise of authoritarianism around the world to inequality. He says it will last a long time (nominally 30 years). He said that the authoritarians had dragged cultural issues onto these economic issues (water is thicker than blood as the old saying doesn't go).<br />Kim finishes by (jokingly) asking if it is just good luck or good management that we haven't had an populist/authoritarian here. She later dawdles her way through listener feedback ignoring any on the professor's opinion.<br />Eric Kaufmann impressed Tyler Cowen and others (the Australian) but got savaged by the unassailable pure at heart "anti-racist" Twitterati. We won't hear his views on RNZ, however because it wouldn't do to know that it was not economics that motivated Trump and Brexit voters but something closer to human nature and that he believes aggrieved whites do have a case.<br />That's why Winston was attacked by the "alt-right" over the message of the UN migration pact and I think he is beginning to realise that his supporters weren't elderly people in community halls (only) but young whites who question why they should welcome becoming minorities in a big liberal experiment - which liberals will likely loose control of anyway?John Hurleynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-15019609399477426322019-08-11T11:20:57.145+12:002019-08-11T11:20:57.145+12:00Leighton Smith [37:00]
Now you've said somethi...Leighton Smith [37:00]<br />Now you've said something that I find interesting. There is much being written about generational change and I mean across societies around the world and the Western world in particular. Inter generational change and the young coming on and replacing the old – introducing new attitudes etc and I'm wondering if this is not part of that then? <br /><br />Michael Bassett<br />Oh I think it is. I don't think there's any doubt about it. But as each generation comes along it is not for them to prize open what are full and final settlements and to play merry hell with the taxpayers money.<br /><br />Leighton Smith<br />Well can I disagree with that ever so slightly. You say it is not their right to do so but it is there opportunity and whether it it their rights are recognised depends on those who are manning the fort.<br />And whether those are weak willed and incapable – and I'm seeing a bit of that at the moment- then why wouldn't you have a go?<br /><br /><br />Michael Bassett<br />I remember a discussion with Helen Clark years ago and her saying that she expected that there would be a lot of full and final settlements that would have to be broken and renegotiated. Well I wish that governments would come out and say that openly to the public because it would all together alter the way people think of the settlement process.<br />https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/podcasts/the-leighton-smith-podcast/the-leighton-smith-podcast-episode-28-august-7th-2019/ <br /><br />Do gooders naively think that if we express concern and virtue (a la Jim Bolger and Gareth Morgan) Maori will settle for say 20% [?] Tariana Turia said her tribes settlements equal 1.5% of what was taken. People on the left think culture will suffice for the hard universal stuff (resources and status). From 1840 there has been dishonesty which is biting us on the bum, we need to show our true hands. If "all the land was stolen" or "most of it or some of it" or was sold too cheaply then lets not be vague about it?<br /><br /> John Hurleynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-1918259799523271032019-08-10T00:04:03.050+12:002019-08-10T00:04:03.050+12:00I've just returned from a holiday with a coupl...I've just returned from a holiday with a couple of guys who I assumed would only ever vote National, and they said (quietly) they are going to vote Winston First. What I said? Yes really and it is exactly because they think he will go with Labour again, and continue his 'great job' of lefty hand break, more than blocking out the awful Greens. Polls probably do not show this because no National man would normally confess support for bloody Winston to strangers. Yet in the quiet privacy of the polling both ….. <br />These fools see him as Centre, whereas I see him as right of National. Alt-Right even. <br />I am interested to dwell on what GS points out, that what was formerly regarded as true Labour is no longer representative of the working class. I'd go further and suggest these days 'workers' often support National because at least they show respect for the hard working battler. Perhaps if they still have jobs come the next election, more of the 'working poor' will quietly vote National on the day. Especially if Labour get further mired in Maori messes, identity politics and other trendy irrelevancies...Charles Enoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-90389029083841090002019-08-08T10:25:22.270+12:002019-08-08T10:25:22.270+12:00No-one really cares about Ihumatao. It's a med...No-one really cares about Ihumatao. It's a media beat up with the flames fanned by the political class. Whether it ends up being a park or a development just doesn't affect most New Zealanders. So far all sides have behaved themselves and it's followed the norms of protest in a democratic country. There's basically nothing disturbing about it, unlike the CCP thugs beating up women at Auckland University.<br /><br />NZF will be fine. They always campaign well and the people who voted for them last time should be pleased with their performance in government. Same goes for the Greens. Both have done better than Labour. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-16856691374225596542019-08-07T13:41:05.520+12:002019-08-07T13:41:05.520+12:00This the problem a lot of commentators seem to hav...This the problem a lot of commentators seem to have when a govt is stable and getting on with doing the job, controversy has to be invented. I am surprised you have lowered your standards to 'shock jock' level Chris. Katnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-22713786842454161442019-08-07T09:19:13.509+12:002019-08-07T09:19:13.509+12:00This is a Tainui issue and it needs to be sorted o...This is a Tainui issue and it needs to be sorted out by them. Those "progressive" opportunists who have attached themselves need to be told to take their miscellaneous causes somewhere else. The government too should pack its tent and take stock. Any temptation to reopen the Treaty settlement process could result in anarchy.Odysseushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04745489060434244478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-46589862128847194982019-08-06T21:22:09.303+12:002019-08-06T21:22:09.303+12:00Bull Chris.Bull Chris.peteswriteplacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04474922953916383101noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-24312498028861355772019-08-06T20:33:48.345+12:002019-08-06T20:33:48.345+12:00Is he going to blow up the coalition?....suspect h...Is he going to blow up the coalition?....suspect hes readying himself for an election at any time and if it comes sooner rather than later he wont mind...every position Winston takes is for the benefit of Winstonpathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08727942156598555852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-56033309661074322572019-08-06T17:57:37.403+12:002019-08-06T17:57:37.403+12:00I don't agree with your analysis. Winston does...I don't agree with your analysis. Winston doesn't want to wreck the government. He wants to bend it. That doesn't require a scorched earth victory. Something more modest will do. So a tripartite solution of Ihumatao will be enough, something that still allows Fletchers to have some form of development, though not of the scale currently proposed.<br /><br />Winston will then use this, and a series of other things (CGT, Three Strikes, etc) to show he is the moderating brake on the government. Come the election, this argument will have a lot of force. Winston has a lot of skill in how to project that during an election campaign.<br /><br />A large part of the NZF supports sits in that space as seeing Winston as their protector. They are not automatically either Labour or National supporters. Probably somewhere between 3 and 7 % of the electorate are natural NZ First supporters, depending on the polling. To do better than that he has to get voters who come from Labour or National. Probably some on the right of Labour and some from the populist part of National.<br /><br />The Labour and Green parts of government are providing quite a lot of things for Winston to fill that space. It will have more power if National does not look like they could form a government. In that case Winston will pick up some the populist National voters who will see Winston as their protector.Wayne Mapphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12906396523791648270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-33698159321699924882019-08-06T14:54:22.816+12:002019-08-06T14:54:22.816+12:00I have just watched Shane Jones on Q&A talking...I have just watched Shane Jones on Q&A talking about Ihumatao. <br /><br />He said the matter is Tainui business, and that housing is more important than faux wahi tapu. <br /><br />What is so inflammatory about that?<br /><br />Has it occurred to anyone that SOUL has shadowy figures behind it who want a protracted dispute?<br /><br />Ihumatao is a matter for Tainui to sort out themselves. The government and the freedom campers should mind their own business.<br /><br />Winston Peters is not going to commit political hari-kari over a cow paddock in Auckland.<br /><br />Political commentators have been predicting the demise of New Zealand First about five minutes after the party was formed.<br /><br />Anyone who thinks polls taken over a year before the next election count for anything should start reading chicken entrails to discern the future. <br /><br /> Shane McDowallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09354384369518580573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-89614850449719267402019-08-06T14:29:15.761+12:002019-08-06T14:29:15.761+12:00"Jacinda could go to the country with the pro..."Jacinda could go to the country with the promise of a genuinely progressive government."<br /><br />That is not going to happen. These days progressive only means socially progressive. So we might get a reform of the abortion laws, but it seems to me that just about every party these days has simply rolled over and accepted neoliberal ideology. It would be interesting to know but I can't be arsed looking it up how many Labour MPs have ever done a "real" job. How many of them have ever suffered from hunger, low pay, his poor working conditions. How many of them have ever had to fight for a decent life? They're just as much much alienated from working-class people as National MPs. I'm sure they sort of understand it intellectually, but they've never lived it so they haven't absorbed it. I'm sure that most of my very nice people and all, and they want to do well, but they have as much idea about the average working-class person's problems as Donald Trump (well maybe a bit more than him.) But they're clinging to this neoliberal straitjacket. What we really need is a comprehensive look into the power relationships between capital and labour which have been overly skewed towards capital since the 1980s. And then, if they have the guts which they don't, we could see some action.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.com