tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post4852741698909265289..comments2024-03-29T00:44:42.046+13:00Comments on Bowalley Road: Perilous Whites: Labour, China and the Liberal Intelligentsia.Chris Trotterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09081613281183460899noreply@blogger.comBlogger56125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-89649665531860454942015-07-31T09:51:39.635+12:002015-07-31T09:51:39.635+12:00When I do the dishes (or cook) I relieve the burde...When I do the dishes (or cook) I relieve the burden with a TED talk. Last night I watched " shaming": John Ronson and the Justine Sacco twitter case (which I hadn't heard of). At the end he said "there seem to be two types of people in the world "those who put human's before ideology and those who put ideology before humans. I put humans before ideology but right now the ideologues are winning and you are either a "hero or a sickening villain"<br />http://www.ted.com/talks/jon_ronson_what_happens_when_online_shaming_spirals_out_of_control#t-813068jhnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-84589107502065757842015-07-26T13:38:12.178+12:002015-07-26T13:38:12.178+12:00So if the Indians had been armed, it would have be...<i>So if the Indians had been armed, it would have been perfectly legit? </i><br /><br /><br />You inserted the word 'perfectly' ----thats a little sly<br /><br />If one shoots down violent armed people that is legitimate under international law during wartime ---regardless the overall morality of the cause one is fighting for.<br /><br />Case A. US soldiers killing Viet Cong in battle<br /><br />US soliders fighting for dishonarable cause, but not committing a war crime.<br /><br />Case B. US soldiers klling at My Lai<br /><br />US soildiers fighting for dishonarouble cause, and kill <i>unarmed</i> civilians. That is a war crime<br /><br />Case C. PLA soliders kill Japanese invaders in battle<br />Honorable cause, legitimate killing<br /><br />Case D. GIs shooting surrendering Germans during DDay (if Private Ryan can be believed.)<br />Honorable cause, illegal killing - a war crime.<br /><br /><br />Now lets rank Cases A to D in ascending order of wickedness - i.e. top is wicked end of spectrum, bottom of list is honorable end<br /><br />Case B<br />Case D<br />Case A<br />Case C<br /><br />China's pacification of Xinjiang falls under Case C (in my view), or Case D (probably in your view). The Armritsar slaughter is definitely a case B.<br /><br />Thus the British action worse than the Chinese pacification of Xinjiang, whichever way you wish to slice or dice it.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-41757486337181506102015-07-26T08:39:32.081+12:002015-07-26T08:39:32.081+12:00So if the Indians had been armed, it would have be...So if the Indians had been armed, it would have been perfectly legit? I think your logic leaves much to be desired.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-88877654940562093112015-07-25T23:27:15.172+12:002015-07-25T23:27:15.172+12:00Having grown up with many Chinese NZers who have b...Having grown up with many Chinese NZers who have been in this country a bloody long time in the great old province of Otago I found that their enterprise and character something to be admired in the fact that they are equal if not more of movers and shakers when it came to the development of business of that province and the present so called racist stance of Labour is a sad realisation of a continuing problem in this country albeit minor in comparison to Australia and its racial attitude but since RD Muldoon and the Dawn Raids there has been an unshakable precedence created in this country that rears it head over the years and now it damages another group of people making their home here <br />We really need to keep a check on ourselves more reason to seriously think about becoming a republic and get everyone to become full citizens and make this their first country maybe that will bite the racist bug in the arse Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-66392905503049298122015-07-25T19:23:38.540+12:002015-07-25T19:23:38.540+12:00Big difference Guerilla Surgeon. One group was una...Big difference Guerilla Surgeon. One group was unarmed. The other violent armed secessionists.<br /><br />Is that a big enough difference for you?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-76930882270130791992015-07-24T16:01:54.607+12:002015-07-24T16:01:54.607+12:00Jesus, I must be blind as a bat. Perhaps you could...Jesus, I must be blind as a bat. Perhaps you could explain how you distinguish between the legitimacy of a government massacring Uighurs, who happen to be included in China against their will, and the legitimacy of the British government legally suppressing an uprising by massacring Indians in Amritsar? Because fuck me I can't see the difference.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-42283176308848745402015-07-24T09:46:11.837+12:002015-07-24T09:46:11.837+12:00Protests against Chinese rule in Tibet. Is 200 a m...<br /><i>Protests against Chinese rule in Tibet. Is 200 a massacre?</i><br /><br /><i>1949. "Pacification" of Turkestan. Does tens of thousands equal a massacre?</i><br /><br />Depends ---soldiers legally suppression rebellion and restoring peace is different from killing people for simply being in a place you want, or because they look different.<br /><br />Wartime deaths are different from genocide massacre:<br /><br />Google American atrocities in Phillipines ---makes the Chinese look like choir boys<br /><br />Also 2 million or so Vietnamese killed by US bombing<br /><br />half a million Iraqis killed by war and sanctions <br /><br />Huge difference ---both in terms of morality, and absolute numbers<br /><br /><br /><br /><i>I could go on, I won't. You are a lost cause.</i><br /><br />Name calling again?<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-81535647847511110372015-07-24T07:58:21.626+12:002015-07-24T07:58:21.626+12:00" According to Beijing, 19 people were killed..." According to Beijing, 19 people were killed and more than 600 wounded in Tibet. Tibet’s government in-exile placed the number of dead at more that 200. Thousands may have been arrested, and in April 2008, the Chinese government sentenced 30 Tibetans to lengthy prison sentences for their alleged roles in rioting."<br /><br />2008. Protests against Chinese rule in Tibet. Is 200 a massacre?<br /><br />"Tens of thousands of Uighurs were killed by Wang's troops in communist China's conquest of East Turkestan. "<br /><br />1949. "Pacification" of Turkestan. Does tens of thousands equal a massacre?<br /><br /><br />"transferred millions of loyal Chinese settlers into East Turkestan, providing them with jobs, housing, bank loans and economic opportunities denied to Uighurs. "<br /><br />I could go on, I won't. You are a lost cause.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-47112962325392216142015-07-23T17:57:25.171+12:002015-07-23T17:57:25.171+12:00As far as the settlers goes, this is a matter of s...<i>As far as the settlers goes, this is a matter of some dispute.</i><br /><br />What is not a matter of dispute is the far higher percentage of the indigenous populations of China, compared to the US (where indigenous are only 1% or so of the population).<br /><br />What is not a matter of dispute is minorities in China have few of the problems that beset say American Indians and Australian aborigines have (high imprisonment rates, alcoholism etc) and their languages are intact and bilingualism even encouraged and funded by the Chinese government. Most Tibetans and Uighurs and Mongols use their own language in everyday conversation --few Maori do anymore. Their cultural vibrancy can be seen by any visitor to the places. <br /><br /><i>In most minority areas of China, including Tibet, local languages are used in grade schools, with putonghua used as a second language. Claims that primary schools in Tibet now teach in putonghua are in error. Tibetan is the main language of instruction in 98 percent of TAR primary schools, while putonghua is introduced in the early grades only in urban schools</i><br /><br />Article by Barry Sautman, who provides an objective and nuanced look <br />http://www.marxmail.org/tibet.pdf<br /><br /><br /><i>You forget that most of the Western "massacres" took place in the 19th century</i><br />Western massacres include the destruction of the Herero in the early 20th Century, the genocidal actions of King Leopold in the Congo, colonial massacres in Madagascare and Vietnam by French authorities, British massacres in Kenya in the 1950s ---refer Caroline Elkins excellent Imperial Reckoning the Untold Story of Britain's Gulag. That's just to start you off with.<br /><br /><br />And your point is we killed everyone off in the 19th century so there was no one left to kill off later on---all nice and happy and peaceful now because those troublesome people are gone?<br /><br /><i>But I don't think I'm losing the argument somehow.</i><br /><br />I think you are.....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-77555151216810731702015-07-23T07:39:29.537+12:002015-07-23T07:39:29.537+12:00As far as the settlers goes, this is a matter of s...As far as the settlers goes, this is a matter of some dispute. And I don't believe the Chinese government's side of it.<br />Recognition by other countries is meaningless. I have no particular feelings either way about Tibetan independence, except to say that they are probably entitled to it if they wish it.<br />The very fact that you cite outside influences in the various disturbances within China, shows that you are true believer. That's the excuse every colonial power users when there are rebellions against its authority. The very excuse the Americans used in Vietnam. But even if it were true, you can't stir up outright rebellion where there are no grievances.<br />You go on about Western massacres, but seem to forget about the Chinese one I mentioned. I could have cited others. You forget that most of the Western "massacres" took place in the 19th century. And in fact recent research has shown that most of the indigenous population of the Americas died off through disease, caught from Westerners perhaps, but they died long before Westerners were even common on the continent.<br />I said you were a troll simply because you ignore any evidence against the Chinese as regards racism and/or bad governance of their minorities. Whether they actually pay you are not I don't know :-). But I don't think I'm losing the argument somehow.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-72826624867606401662015-07-22T19:08:23.275+12:002015-07-22T19:08:23.275+12:00Why for instance, are they flooding Tibet with mil...<i>Why for instance, are they flooding Tibet with millions of Han Chinese settlers? </i><br /><br />That's actually been shown to be a load of bs - you do some serious research about it.<br /><br />The Tibetans are about 80% the population of Tibet -- slightly more than the 1 or 2% indigenous in the US or Australia or the 15%? in NZ.<br /><br />Every Western govt, including NZ and US supports and recognises China's sovereignt over Tibet.<br /><br />So Tibet is a legitimate part of CHina. Given that, TIbetans have the right to move to any part of China, as do Han and other minorities. <br /><br />The Chinese govt would be wrong to prevent Han from moving to Tibet in the same way the NZ govt would be wrong to prevent Pakeha moving to say Northland (with a large Maori population).<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-25570724293858028642015-07-22T19:03:21.235+12:002015-07-22T19:03:21.235+12:00You say: "So yes I can compare these treatmen...You say: <i>"So yes I can compare these treatments, because there is very little threat to national sovereignty in China from a few minorities gaining independence for instance"</i><br /><br />Your linked article contradicts this claim<br /><br /><i>The largest non-Han minorities are the Uyghurs, Mongols and Tibetans, and the territories inhabited by these three minorities occupy a huge proportion of China's land mass along its western and northern borders, territories which in recent times have become increasingly strategically important in terms of resources and location.</i><br /><br />The difference is the Chinese have not massacred, killed off the indigenous, as was the case in Anglo Saxon settled places. Australia and the US do not fear this type of thing because they slaughtered the indigenous and what few are remaiming are demoralised and in reservations.<br /><br />Minority populations have actually <i>increased</i> under the PRC, including Tibetans ---minorites are not restricted to one child, as are the Hans. The PRC officially recognises the principle of autonomy for national minorities.<br /><br />This is the exact opposite of the US, Australia, and even NZ until very recently.<br /><br />Unlike the US (the highest incarceration rate by far in the world), where minorities are hugely overrepresented in the prison population, minorities in China are actually underrrepresnted ---refer research by New Zealander Barry Sautman.<br /><br /><i>real" insurrection does not happen for trivial reasons. It usually the result of long periods of discrimination and racial animus.</i><br /><br />Or it can be provoked and stirred up by hostile powers. Again refer to the Ureweras ---just a sniff of Maori playing with firearms has the whole force of the state come crashing down.<br /><br /><br /><i>"I'm beginning to think you're a Chinese government troll."</i><br /><br />People that resort to name calling typically do so because they know they are losing the argument.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-8044936566785380182015-07-22T07:42:15.553+12:002015-07-22T07:42:15.553+12:00"What country you referring to ....that '..."What country you referring to ....that 'kills off people so that it doesn't have to have its laws based on race'?"<br /><br />Fuck me you are so literal minded. And you accuse me of lying as well. AND I have to correct your spelling.<br /><br />I have read all the shit about affirmative action in China. It is purely for propaganda purposes, so they can show them off to tourists usually. <br /><br />http://www.minorityrights.org/5324/china/china-overview.html<br /><br />And for every link you can post showing how they treat them so very well, I can find at least half a dozen that show the opposite.<br /><br />When I mentioned Malaysia's laws I was not referring to the British in Malaya, but the laws which discriminate against Chinese living there. You don't seem to realise that these exist. How convenient.<br /><br />"And you cannot compare 'treatment' where there is a threat to national sovereignty and real insurrection "<br /><br />"real" insurrection does not happen for trivial reasons. It usually the result of long periods of discrimination and racial animus. So yes I can compare these treatments, because there is very little threat to national sovereignty in China from a few minorities gaining independence for instance. And even if there was – so what? Why should the Han Chinese basically determine the fate of non-Han? Why for instance, are they flooding Tibet with millions of Han Chinese settlers? Somewhat reminiscent of Israel settling parts of Palestine they don't own.<br />I'm beginning to think you're a Chinese government troll.<br /><br />Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-67242884082894365712015-07-21T18:56:08.034+12:002015-07-21T18:56:08.034+12:00I also find it somewhat intriguing that you find t...<i> I also find it somewhat intriguing that you find that a country that bases its laws on race seemingly less reprehensible in a country that kills off people so that it doesn't have to have its laws based on race. </i><br /><br />What country you referring to ....that 'kills off people so that it doesnt have to have its laws based on race'?<br /><br />Laws based on ancestry are different from ones based on racial supremacism.<br /><br />Many countries have laws based on ancestry --if you have a british grandparent you get a UK passport, if not you do not----thats not racist. If you are born in certain European countries you have to have ancestors there to be a citizen jus sanguinis and not jus soli ----harsh ---yes, racist? Not necessarily.<br /><br /><i>As far as I remember it was a listener column. I doubt if it's on the net, I read it long before the Internet existed.</i><br /><br />How convenient.<br /><br /><br /><br /> <i>If you want to accept the Chinese government propaganda on the way it treats its minorities fine. I will have nothing else to say on that. If you read what the actual minority say about the Chinese treatment of them you might learn something.</i><br /><br />Affirmative action in China:<br />http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19970826&slug=2556773<br /><br />Hardly comparable to Apartheid South Africa or Nazi Germany.<br /><br />And you cannot compare 'treatment' where there is a threat to national sovereignty and real insurrection (i.e. like in Northern Ireland in the past, Russia and Chechyna, China, British in Malaya etc) with treatment of minorities in a peaceful society where the indigenous are a tiny tiny percent of the population.<br /><br />Look at what happened in the Ureweras several years ago ----just a sniff that something was happening and the cops went into overkill to say the least. Not saying right or wrong either way, but it does show that most governemtns are sensitive to independence movements etc.<br /><br />The only governments that don't have much to fear are where the indigenous have been basically slaughtered off.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-67916163685689005962015-07-21T16:51:17.379+12:002015-07-21T16:51:17.379+12:00Sorry, computer problems. I also find it somewhat ...Sorry, computer problems. I also find it somewhat intriguing that you find that a country that bases its laws on race seemingly less reprehensible in a country that kills off people so that it doesn't have to have its laws based on race. Just sayin'.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-27567557854883155812015-07-21T15:44:34.778+12:002015-07-21T15:44:34.778+12:00Anonymous:
1.As far as I remember it was a listen...Anonymous: <br />1.As far as I remember it was a listener column. I doubt if it's on the net, I read it long before the Internet existed.<br />2. On the second point you sound like a Chinese troll. If you want to accept the Chinese government propaganda on the way it treats its minorities fine. I will have nothing else to say on that. If you read what the actual minority say about the Chinese treatment of them you might learn something.<br />3. There are plenty of non-Western societies that have had laws based on race. A simple Google search comes up with dozens of examples. Try Malaysia for a start. And of course most of the castes in India are based on race. And don't tell me that the laws in India now forbid discrimination on the basis of caste, they do, but it still exists.<br />I believe you can't just dismiss 'local massacres' they are often the results of deep seated racism... so... You could consider the Armenian Greek and Assyrian massacres by Turkey in the early part of the 20th century. And perhaps some of Stalin's genocidal actions. Unless you regard Turks and Russians as West Europeans. Not to mention the Dzungar genocide by the Ming emperor in the middle of the 18th century.And then of course there's the massacres of the Ibo in Nigeria. I could go on but google is your friend right.<br />Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-81642162204416812222015-07-20T17:12:54.491+12:002015-07-20T17:12:54.491+12:00When I grew up a New Zealander would head overseas...<i>When I grew up a New Zealander would head overseas but they could always come back "home" without being seen as part of a housing problem...blah blah blah blah blah blah....You didn't battle for a bus stop with a driver born in China.</i><br /><br />So JH... it seems it is all about overpopulation---you have not mentioned anything specific to the Chinese and the problems you mention, real or perceived, are created surely just as much by white migrants from South African and the UK, the aggregate number of which would outnumber Chinese.<br /><br />Surely one Englishman contributes to overpopulation as much as one Chinese?<br /><br />And you conveniently ignored this one, so I'll copy and paste below:<br /><br />Tell you what is true though, know a couple of coloured South African migrants---they tell me racism runs deep within the white South African community here, and he is basically shunned by what should be his compatriotrs. These white south Africans had the highest standard of living in the world, and they ran here to get away from black rule, but they bring their racist views with them. One I knew at work openly referred to Chester Williams as a kaffir.<br /><br />They also buy up big on the shore..<br /><br />Now do you have a problem with them as well Jh?<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-62847226705191839062015-07-20T17:09:40.459+12:002015-07-20T17:09:40.459+12:00The statement was made as part of a column that su...<i>The statement was made as part of a column that suggested that Chinese kids were brought up to feel superior to everyone else. It certainly was meant to illustrate prevailing thought. </i><br /><br />Well its sheer and utter bollocks ----can you find the link? <br /><br /><i>This is much the same as the animus which drives Chinese policy towards their minorities today.</i><br /><br />What animus? China is actually far in advance of Western countries when it comes to affirmative action. <br /><br />Furthermore minorities in China have typically preserved their folkways and traditions far more so than indigenous peoples in the Americas and Australia and even New Zealand (until more recently).<br /><br />And there was never the sort of genocide that happened to Native Americans etc.<br /><br /><br /><i>You should visit some of the websites that allow comments on the treatment of Chinese minorities. People say what they think, rather than what the government propagandists tell them to say. And that is racist to the core.</i><br /><br />Really? Links please....and even then you can find bloggers saying all sorts of stuff on anything.<br /><br /><i>".... Rwanda. I suggest you look a little at the history of that country, where an ethnic group was pretty much invented so they could massacre them"</i><br /><br />I was referring, if you could read properly, to the founding of entire countries and polities on racist policies and codified laws based on race, the systematic and sustained over decades or longer. <br /><br />Not to localised massacres, terrible that they might be. One could also mention Croats slaughtering Serbs, Ukrainians slaughtering Poles etc during the war. But why is the Holocaust mentioned as a unique event? Because of something similar to what I have said above. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-32389057062013419032015-07-20T11:13:59.776+12:002015-07-20T11:13:59.776+12:00The statement was made as part of a column that su...The statement was made as part of a column that suggested that Chinese kids were brought up to feel superior to everyone else. It certainly was meant to illustrate prevailing thought. This is much the same as the animus which drives Chinese policy towards their minorities today. You can argue all you like, but this is racism. And it's many of those northern European whites who are now pressing for inclusive policies in the US. So you can't just sheet it home to one particular ethnic group. You should visit some of the websites that allow comments on the treatment of Chinese minorities. People say what they think, rather than what the government propagandists tell them to say. And that is racist to the core.<br />Not to mention you have ignored one of the biggest, and certainly the quickest massacre ever on record – in Rwanda. I suggest you look a little at the history of that country, where an ethnic group was pretty much invented so they could massacre them. Sorry, your ideas are – I was going to say crap, but let's say uninformed.Guerilla Surgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03427876447124021423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-65937341446086463752015-07-20T09:25:56.957+12:002015-07-20T09:25:56.957+12:00But real vicious racism is the preserve of North W...But real vicious racism is the preserve of North West European whites. That is why you had events such as the Holocaust, Jim Crow in the US, Apartheid South Africa.<br /><br />In fact the only three polities in history to found their societies on race hate and racial discrimination are the aforementioned. <br />....<br />only because it was their turn first?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-43884978470197630092015-07-20T08:57:59.398+12:002015-07-20T08:57:59.398+12:00Anonymous Anonymous said...
They aren't coming...Anonymous Anonymous said...<br />They aren't coming here to change a whole way of life and identity (a feeling of ownership and inalienable belonging by blood [common history and ancestry])? Is it wrong to value that identity?<br /><br />How has your life changed? Come on. Some examples.<br />........<br /><br />When I grew up a New Zealander would head overseas but they could always come back "home" without being seen as part of a housing problem.<br /><br />You could trust the politicians to hold your interests at heart: the guns faced outwards (you knew who you were, you knew who a New Zealander was and you knew it was <i>your</i> country).<br /><br />The property market was an internal one, slow and relaxed. Poor people had a bolt hole (retire by the sea) Now the beautiful hills I roamed as are kid are for sale in Hong Kong. We go to zoning meetings to learn that "oh well, we have immigration and you have to have population increase to increase the wealth [of real estate developers]"<br /><br />You didn't battle for a bus stop with a driver born in China.jhnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-22368364579015397822015-07-20T08:22:39.506+12:002015-07-20T08:22:39.506+12:00Anonymous
Well then, since you are part of the pro...Anonymous<br />Well then, since you are part of the problem, you should go back to Europe.<br />........<br /><i>In the new edition of Being Pakeha, I go on to say that, as another indication of how far Pakeha culture has become indigenous, it is only right to see the macrocarpa and the wooden church as being as much emblematic of the New Zealand landscape and human occupation of it, as the meeting house and the cabbage tree.</i><br />Michael King<br /><br />"the non-whites have hardly killed stacks of whites"<br />Gengis Khan had an empire as big as Africa. He filled moats with dead bodies and rode over them - so they say.<br /><br />"Yet you seem to blame non-whites for the problems of the world?"<br /><br />No I blame social scientists who believe human nature can be over ridden and polices that are blind to ecological/population issues and politicians/media who suppress voices such as Michael Reddell, Dr Greg Clydesdale, The Australian Productivity Commision, The Savings Working Group.<br /><br />Ranganui Walker<br /><i>In March 1991 the Government Working Party on Immigration reported to Mr Birch, the Minister of Immigration. The report recommended the adoption of a points system for the selection of immigrants with skills and money for business investment in New Zealand. The Minister called meetings with a limited selection of 13 Maori leaders in Auckland and 14 in Wellington to consider the report. They were mainly leaders of voluntary organisations. Few of them represented tribal groups. Although many speakers spoke against the immigration proposals, they were ignored. When the Minister was questioned in Parliament during the debate on the Immigration Amendment Bill, he cited all those in attendance at the Maori meetings as being ‘broadly positive’ towards his immigration scheme. This glossing over of Maori opposition is consistent with the procedure of elites generating policy from above and imposing it on the people below. The report was a fait accompli, and the Minister’s restricted discourse with Maori leaders after the fact, gave an illusion of democratic consultation. The select committee hearings on the Bill were also a charade. Of the 75 submissions made to the committee, 73 opposed the Bill. The two submissions in favour were made by immigration consultants, the people who earned substantial fees from processing immigration papers for clients wanting to get into New Zealand.</i>Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15607028751724602829noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-29166090428436371422015-07-19T23:46:29.154+12:002015-07-19T23:46:29.154+12:00They aren't coming here to change a whole way ...<i>They aren't coming here to change a whole way of life and identity (a feeling of ownership and inalienable belonging by blood)? Is it wrong to value that identity?</i><br /><br />How has your life changed? Come on. Some examples. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-90719483426051268462015-07-19T23:45:32.226+12:002015-07-19T23:45:32.226+12:00but I do remember a Chinese columnist once writing... <i>but I do remember a Chinese columnist once writing something like "I was 16 before I realised that non-Chinese people were just as intelligent as Chinese people."</i><br /><br />Really? If it is true, then all sorts of people say shit at different times. And it would hardly be a prevailing thought.<br /><br />Google "Most whites say blacks are lazier or less intelligent than whites"<br /><br />But real vicious racism is the preserve of North West European whites. That is why you had events such as the Holocaust, Jim Crow in the US, Apartheid South Africa.<br /><br />In fact the only three polities in history to found their societies on race hate and racial discrimination are the aforementioned. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-53171510070274624572015-07-19T23:40:23.460+12:002015-07-19T23:40:23.460+12:00Evolutionary psychology (sociobiology) holds that ...<i>Evolutionary psychology (sociobiology) holds that humans are not designed to slip into a multicultural world having evolved in smallish groups during the Pleistocene</i><br /><br />Well then, since you are part of the problem, you should go back to Europe.<br /><br />If Europeans had stayed in Europe they would not have got multiculturalism.<br /><br />Don't blame non-whites for your problem ----the non-whites have hardly killed stacks of whites---it has always been whites klling whites and in some cases carrying out outright genocide.<br /><br />That happened in a continent with almost zero non-whites.<br /><br />Yet you seem to blame non-whites for the problems of the world?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com