tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post7763799236189017201..comments2024-03-29T03:41:12.499+13:00Comments on Bowalley Road: The Braying Of The DamesChris Trotterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09081613281183460899noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-41603668420334271612011-07-04T22:15:40.312+12:002011-07-04T22:15:40.312+12:00Hi Victor, and thanks for the delayed response. I...Hi Victor, and thanks for the delayed response. I would like to question why enforcing the taxation would be a bad thing. As you believe that the average Greek or Italian is paying their taxes at the source then they have nothing to worry about by tightening the noose on tax avoidance. As I had mentioned, this austerity problem could have been avoided had all this been sorted prior to this problem if the taxes had been paid. From the Italians I know personally tax avoideance is almost a sport there, and many say their greek counterparts are as equally skilled as they are.<br /><br />IF the loopholes are closed on taxes in Greece what would this mean? It would mean more close scrutiny on small businesses and small independent operators. Unfortunately these are often the ones skipping on taxes, removing it from employees' paychecks and not passing it on to the government. These are many of the people suffering from a cut ingovernment services as well. Cutting the loopholes for the rich is a matter of the government having the balls to do such and I simply don't see many european governments doing any such thing. It's a shame because surely that shores up many financial weaknesses by itself. <br /><br />I don't blame the Greeks for fighting, hell, the promises they've been given for generations are being stolen away. But there's a very large number of people to be held accountable for the entire problem and the banks and government are only half the problem when getting out of paying taxes or any other sort of government levies is viewed almost as sport. I do feel for those who are going to be without help but feel many could do a turn taking out their anger on many other targets than just the government. When are they going to storm the rich estates? I'm waiting to see that happen.Madisonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-40486671060758443062011-07-03T12:18:23.792+12:002011-07-03T12:18:23.792+12:00Madison
I think it's fair to say that it'...Madison<br /><br />I think it's fair to say that it's essentially the more monied Greeks and Italians who so successfully avoid paying taxes.<br /><br />This is , of course, a lot harder for wage earners or beneficiaries, whose tax, as elsewhere, gets largely deducted at source. Yet these are the people who will be doing most of the paying under the austerity regime.<br /><br />BTW I recall when VAT (the equivalent of GST) was introduced into Britain ahead of the country's accession to the then EEC. <br /><br />We were given to understand that the new tax was necessary to harmonise our fiscal arrangements with those wretched continentals who, unlike us clean-limbed, virtuous children of Albion, never paid their income tax.<br /><br />And now, VAT has become a major impost on the poor, as GST has become here. Moreover, Chris, it imposes a huge and often prohibitive burden of time and administration on the small businesses that you envisage flourishing with the aid of early Super payouts. <br /><br />Markus<br /><br />Your hates do you credit.<br /><br />I would, though, recommend the bits in Anne Leslie's biography, 'Killing my own Snakes', about her childhood in the twilight of the Raj. I thought it incredibly well-written, unlike most of the rest of the tome. <br /><br />There again, I wouldn't like to vouch for its accuracy, as the bits concerning times and places I do know something about seemed a wee bit off the mark.Victornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-88636267758488288922011-07-02T00:12:43.082+12:002011-07-02T00:12:43.082+12:00I simply CANNOT STAND Anne Leslie !!!!!
She's...I simply CANNOT STAND Anne Leslie !!!!!<br /><br />She's long been a regular on BBC WORLD'S 'Dateline London'. Dyed-in-the-Wool Right-Wing, Thatcherite Tory, who generally has no idea what she's talking about. Her knowledge of foreign affairs is absolutely bloody abysmal.markusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-12106718948379873142011-07-01T23:29:36.857+12:002011-07-01T23:29:36.857+12:00A hell of a lot of the Greek's troubles could ...A hell of a lot of the Greek's troubles could have been sorted if personal responsibility was even remotely suggested here. Not austerity measures, not cutting pensions or benefits. Paying the damn taxes would have wuite nicely closed the doors on the 'crisis' and kept it an annoyance. And I think this applies across the board. Hit the corporations, hit the millionaires, but also hit the working class just as hard. <br /><br />Greeks and Italians are world famous for their escapes from taxes, yet if they paid these taxes they would probably be able to fully benefit from the system they so desire. If you want to get all the money back from the government perhaps you should pay in first. Just to add, I'm all in favour of enforcing the same here. Hell, start working on the student loan people as well.Madisonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-18966374640804588602011-07-01T19:38:11.727+12:002011-07-01T19:38:11.727+12:00Chris.
B. S.
On both scenarios
MickChris.<br /><br />B. S.<br /><br />On both scenarios<br /><br />MickAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-7627112022961423912011-07-01T16:33:13.601+12:002011-07-01T16:33:13.601+12:00Bravo, Chris! (or words to that effect of a more s...Bravo, Chris! (or words to that effect of a more suitably working class nature)<br />However, the meek shall inherit the Earth.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16219657564984291522noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-31690901966893269582011-07-01T14:02:12.056+12:002011-07-01T14:02:12.056+12:00"An early retirement age and generous pension..."An early retirement age and generous pensions for workers not only open up the labour market to the young (think how many Gen-Xers would celebrate if the Baby-Boomers could get out of their way at 50!)"<br /><br />I think they would celebrate more if they knew their country would still be able to pay them a pension once they retired. I'm pretty sure NZ wouldn't be able to pay for a lot of things if Boomers all collected the pension at 50 here.Adzehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11813585763033310686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-39656655340381217472011-07-01T12:02:29.953+12:002011-07-01T12:02:29.953+12:00Sorry, Victor, my mistake. She's a Dame - not ...Sorry, Victor, my mistake. She's a Dame - not a Duchess - duly corrected.Chris Trotterhttp://bowalleyroad.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-60674091681420487072011-07-01T11:56:50.285+12:002011-07-01T11:56:50.285+12:00Mark
I agree with you that a common currency is d...Mark<br /><br />I agree with you that a common currency is difficult to sustain across a wide diversity of countries. For this very reason, we should be opposed to any suggestions of a currency union with Australia. <br /><br />Chris is of course right that a neo-liberal orthodoxy is being visited on the Greeks for essentially ideological reasons. This, of course, does not mean ipso facto, that the Greek state hasn't been profligate. Nor are the gripes of the hard working and frugal citizenry of North Rhine Westphalia on this issue totally without substance. <br /><br />However, there is a similar, if, for the moment, less radical, consensus of the powerful in favour of neo-liberal ideological rigidity in New Zealand, despite the fact that we have one of the least profligate state sectors in the OECD. <br /><br />Meanwhile, from an ethical perspective, it might require the intellect of an Aristotle to decide whether Greece deserves its current economic travails.<br /><br />But, I agree, there's a straight forward practical question about whether imposing ever more radical frugality on the Hellenes will ever get their economy out of schtuch.Victornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-72027454777315438212011-07-01T11:55:30.654+12:002011-07-01T11:55:30.654+12:00Come on now, Mark, use your imagination!
An early...Come on now, Mark, use your imagination!<br /><br />An early retirement age and generous pensions for workers not only open up the labour market to the young (think how many Gen-Xers would celebrate if the Baby-Boomers could get out of their way at 50!) but it also allows older workers to provide voluntary labour to sports, cultural and community welfare organisations, and to set up small, family-based businesses.<br /><br />Theoretically, the State stands to collect more in revenue than it spends. <br /><br />Greece's problem lies in the social and political gridlock that arose out of the Right's refusal to accept the verdict of democracy.<br /><br />Extensive social welfare provision, a massive public service and a wink-wink, nudge-nudge refusal to properly administer the country's tax system was the "Danegeld" the Greek state was forced to pay to its contending social classes in order to ward off yet another round of civil strife.<br /><br />What's more, until the onset of the global financial crisis, it was a ransom the rest of Europe was perfectly willing to finance.<br /><br />Now, all the bets are off - and low - the civil strife returns.Chris Trotterhttp://bowalleyroad.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-64959236681796009302011-07-01T11:30:58.559+12:002011-07-01T11:30:58.559+12:00Which Labour Peer are you referring to?
Unless th...Which Labour Peer are you referring to?<br /><br />Unless things have changed in the last few weeks, Anne Leslie is just a Dame and hence not a Peer, not a member of the House of Lords and not a member of any parliamentary party. <br /><br />Having just worked my way through her good-in-parts-and-awful-in-others autobiography, I'd be very surprised to discover she had any sort of Labour affiliation. <br /><br />It did seem to me , though, that her chat with Kathryn Ryan took place well into the Home Counties G&T hour and was perhaps all the more revealing for that reason.Victornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3753486518085091399.post-73887369703298609602011-07-01T10:56:10.448+12:002011-07-01T10:56:10.448+12:00Not sure how this is a class struggle. How can any...Not sure how this is a class struggle. How can anyone justify retiring at 50? Just as you and I wouldn't be able to save a nest egg for retirement by 50, neither can a country.<br /><br />The issue here is the banks have just shifted their bad decisions/bad debts on to the EU countries and IMF. Once again passing on their bad lending decisions.<br /><br />Everyone knows the Greeks can't repay these debts anyway - even with minor savings. <br />The real issue is that the Euro is unworkable across such a broad range of economies. Greece needs to break out and let it's currency float, and reflect it's true value - as with their interest rates. They would find a devaluation would increase income from exports/tourism.<br /><br />Instead they are stuck in step with Germany and completely different economic cycles. They get low interest rates at the wrong time.<br /><br />The EU are fighting to save the Euro, and dumping huge future burdens on the greeks - of whatever class.....Marknoreply@blogger.com